I-84

[Xman]

Well everyone it has come to my attention and for those who dont know of this yet. I-84 is apparantely closed to park off the side of the road unless it is designated a parking area. I received a lovely citation last week for parking in probably one of the most prominent fishing pulloffs in the area.

What this means is if you pull off to fish the river and it is off of 84 you will receive a $25 ticket. It seems UDOT the rightful owners of the roads not the tax payers has decided they dont want people parking off the road and are now flexing their muscles and making the local authorties hand out citations. If you cant tell I am extremely pissed off about this matter. These are areas I have parked and fished around for over 10 years. I know guys that have been going to some of these spots for over 30. And now all of the sudden you just cant pakr there because they say so. What is the reasoning? the point?

Oh im sure its some security risk based on all the new global threats or some junk like that.

Either way any of you that fish the weber or even care about your freedoms as a citizen of this state should be quite mad about this. Our taxdollars paid for the dang thing at least you could be able to park in a spot that has been parked in for more years than i can count.
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[Matador]

Xman,

That stinks. It really does and I am sorry that it happened to you. But the authorities didn't just decide to make it illegal. It has always been illegal. They just decided to start enforcing it. I-84 is an interstate and as such it is illegal to pull off the side of the road(even way off into the dirt) for anything other than an emergency. Even if you stop on the shoulder to check a map, which is better than driving with your face buried in the map, it is illegal. You asked why. A major reason is because it is dangerous for everyone around when a car is trying to get in and out of 65+ mph traffic without an on-ramp or off-ramp. Many times I've had to dodge people that seem to forget that merging at 5 mph is extremely hazardous when everyone else in close proximity is doing 65. Unfortunately careful people have to obey the same laws as careless people so that nobody gets killed.

It is lousy when they do this sort of thing without warnings, especially when the infraction has been ignored for years. And I believe you when you say that it has been allowed for years. A better question would be, 'why now?'. Security? No. Why would a terrorist blow up a road in po-dunk Utah? Money? Probably. Power trip? Maybe. But it is a rotten deal no matter what the reason. Issuing warnings first would have been better.

No offense intended. Take care.

m
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[leaky]

Totally agree with both of you!!!!!!!!! That is the [url "mailto:#**@@#'s"]#**@@#'s[/url] I've been lucky since I've been using the frontage road between echo and rockport for a while. Time to switch areas? It's been pretty good for me up there, mostly white fish though. Probably my method of fishing.

[crazy]Leaky

[Xman]

well regardless of the law that surrounds it i will have my two cents put out on this one. it is a clear wide open 200 yard flattened dirt area off the road. literally receives probably 10 different cars park there any given week and probably more. i have parked over 100 times there in certain years.

the reason you say, i know exactly why. money. my point is the state and legislation should be held accountable for things instead of legislating rampently and or enforcing laws at their leisure. a warning at first is totally agreed. cmon give me a break, no no parking signs anywhere and then write a citation. the decent thing would be at least a warning letting people know not to do it anymore. but that is the clue what its all about. hey lets jab as many people as we can for $25. i wonder whos bonus im funding this year hmmm.
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[Hellsangler69]

I know that would chap me for sure . Been pulling up to some of those spots for about 20 years now and now they want to ticket people for that . GRRR
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[loanfish]

I bet you wouldnt have to pay for a ticket in downtown s.l.c. if you went in and said there are no signs posted. Thats a load of crap. What if you tresspass onto someones land and its not posted and get a ticket. Xman you outa tell them that you'll pay for the ticket if it goes toward the purchase of a sign that posts the warning. thats my 2 cents. what a joke!



GOOD FISHIN TO YA'ALL and careful parking too!!!!!!!!!!
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[Xman]

it sounds funny but that was exactly what i planned on saying. since there are no signs and since they decided to just start posting it i think my dollars should go to somewhee useful and thats by saving another poor soul out there the hastle and frustration of coming back after a nice day of fishing to a little white slip on your vehicle stating a citation. the great part about it is since its a parking violation i didnt have to sign it either. so i have a citation though i didnt sign it promising to show up in court.

the whole thign just bugs me.
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[loanfish]

Tell em' to remove all of the parking restriction signs downtown and see haw people react to a ticket then. I had no idea there were metermaids on I-84.



GOOD FISHIN TO YA'ALL!!!!!!!!!!!
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[barbless]

Xman, where were you parked at on 84? I fish along there all the time, and if they start ticketing the areas that provide access to great fishin holes that will suck. If they are ticketing in the area I always go maybe I could just turn on my flashers and the law will think my car is just there because it is broken down. But, really I will just be off fishing and come back to no ticket..might be sound drastic but there are some good stretches along 84 that I don't want to stop fishing.

Hope something good turns out with this.

cya--barbless

[ALAN]

Xman---Better be careful, just because you didn't sign that ticket{which is a bunch of bull} doesn't mean they won't set you a court date. My lady friend got a ticket and didn't take care if it right away and when she went to they had a warrant out for her for missing her court date. Seems that its your responsibility to call and find out when the court date is. Since you already have the ticket, they are not required to send you a notice. Sound like a bunch of crap? Her ticket went from $45.00 to $530.00 just because she didn't call to find out if she had a court date. Her ticket was for out dated tabs. I agree with you wanting to make your voice heard, as you should. Just becareful you don't get shafted anymore. Al
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[Kayote]

It's the Californication of Utah. The people use got so high years ago on most of the National Forests in Cal that they have done the same thing. You can only park in designated parking areas. The next step is to charge a fee to use the parking areas. It's a money thing. You pay to park or you pay the ticket. Either way it's a real fund raiser for the powers that be. Next you ban motorcycles, snowmobiles, jet skis and mountain bikes. The fire danger was so high in Southern Cal last year people simply were not allowed on the forests at all. Look into the crystal ball and you will see your future my friend.

Good Parking, Kayote
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[Kayote]

Just a guess here Guest, but you're a cop aren't you?. Your response just seemed a little slanted towards LE. Just because there is a parking law in place doesn't mean it's just. Your fishing analogy doesn't hold water. When you purchase a fishing license, a proclamation is offered at no cost which outlines all the angling regulations statewide. I have never seen a proclamation with all the unposted illegal parking areas in the state. If it's not posted, how is a person supposed to know it's not legal?. These are our friends and neighbors that are being harassed. Law abiding, tax paying citizens who actually are the owners of the forest they wish to use. Your comment that the ticket is the warning is just stupid. All a ticket does is make people dislike law enforcement officials. Warnings show compassion, which is a sign of intelligence. D'Oh.

Good Busting, Kayote
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[loanfish]

It seems to me it would also be just as easy to me to throw up a sign. How much could that possibly cost? We can constanly argue about how things ought to work. I'm sure there are other things that money is spent on in courtesy of the public to avoid situations as this one. I would hope that their goal is not to see how many stupid people dont remember the handbook from drivers ed, and park where they shouldnt, just to see how many tickets they can issue before the people that fish the river take a hint. That would be highly unethicle and unproffessional. And if I were to quiz you on that handbook do you think you will answer correctly to all those little laws that are in effect. Lets be honest unless the officer issuing the ticket remembers that law at that very moment he or she wont even issue a ticket. I'm pretty young still and i dont know a soul that could tell you all the rules and regulations from the driver handbook or the proclamation, I sure as heck would not be able to. Look at all the fishing reg signs posted at many access points on fishable waters. I suppose they wouldnt have to post those either. It seems to me that posting signs would be the responsible and respective thing to do. I do not by any means wish to offend you Guest nor do I dissagree with the fact that parking is illegal on an interstate. This is mearly my opinion. I do apologize if I did offend you! Thanks and



GOOD FISHIN TO YA!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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[FlyFishingMoose]

OK, OK I can see the frusteration, but why would the state put the ladders over the fence all along I-84 from I-89 to Riverdale exit if they didn't want you to go enjoy fishing. Do they really want a bunch of fishermen walking down the freeway with all their stuff just to get back to one of the ladders, so we don't tear up the fences that are in place! Are the ladders put ther by the state or is all that riverfront privately owned. I think we need someone from the state to answer these kinds of Q's. I know regardless whether it is not posted and I got ticked I'd be one unhappy soul and would let someone know how I felt about it other than here in this forum.
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[RipNLips]

The primary laws that apply are

[url "http://www.le.state.ut.us/~code/TITLE41/htm/41_04135.htm"]Utah Code - Title 41, Chapter 6, Section 103 - Standing or parking vehicles -- Restrictions and exceptions.[/url]

[url "http://www.le.state.ut.us/~code/TITLE41/htm/41_04080.htm"]Utah Code - Title 41, Chapter 6, Section 64 - Controlled-access highways -- Driving onto and from highways where permitted.[/url]

With that said, I totally agree with XMan. Because public officials allowed the law to be bent by the public for so long, signs would have been in order before issuing citations.

How many of you guys remember the good old days when you used to be able to pull off I-15 and fish the east dike at Willard? When the state decided to start enforcing the law there, they posted signs that remained for several years. The signs have since been removed, and you don't see people parking there now. However, posting the signs for a couple of years helped those of us that had gotten used to pulling off I-15 and fishing the east dike learn that the law was going to start being enforced.
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[loanfish]

Thankyou RipNlips for taking your time out to gather that info!



GOOD FISHIN TO YA!!!!!!!!!!![]
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[Kayote]

Guest,

You may not be an officer, but you are obviously closely aligned with one somewhere amongst your friends and family. Why else would you have such a passion for busting your fellow sporstmen?. C'mon, your brother, dad, best friend, who is it ?. LMAO. I do bitch and moan about law enforcement, but certainly not for a lack of it. If a lot of our good people are getting ticketed on a regular basis, somethings wrong with the law, not the people. FYI: The DOT does not own the roads anymore than the DWR owns the wildlife. They hold it in trust for the people of Utah. You know, the ones you want arrested for fishing. On that happy note, you should join BFT so I don't have to debate some anonymous guest. We're not all as pissy as me. Later

Good Fishing, Kayote
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[martymcfly]

Hi gang, just thought I would put in my 2 cents worth. I think the law is not only ridiculous but why the hell did they spend our tax dollars putting up ladders along the freeway if we can't park there? I wrote an email to my congresswoman (State) to make sure that at least my voice was heard. If it really irritates you then I suggest you do the same, and I have attached the link so you can do just that.

[url "http://www.le.state.ut.us/house/DistrictInfo/NewMaps/State.htm"]http://www.le.state.ut.us/house/DistrictInfo/NewMaps/State.htm[/url]
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[Kayote]

Guest,

Maybe your old Grandpa is right. He's been around a long time and has seen changes for the worse. As far as switching areas, adjusting?. Why. This should be fought head on. DOT should have installed angler access in the original road planning. So now anglers are punished for DOT's lack of forsight?. If you keep accepting loss of access to our sport, pretty soon we'll have to go to Wyoming to fish. They should be closing the Provo any day now, and according to your logic, we should just accept it and move on. Not this cowboy. I also must take umbrage with your comment about nailing all the poachers. How many poachers have you actually seen?. Most wildlife violations are honest sportsmen who made an error. Forgot to notch the tag, sign the license, leave evidence of sex (parked in the wrong damn spot). By god, hang the felons. Give me a break. When we alienate our clientele, they quit participating in the sport. This is why we have declining participation in hunting in Utah. No clientele means no funding and the resource ultimately suffers. Make an honest man who made a mistake feel like a criminal and he won't be back. You really need to sign up for BFT Guest. Don't hide behind the anonymous guest listing.

Keep It Coming, Kayote
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[Matador]

I don't want to stir the pot but I have a few things to say about this too. I also hate law breakers and I like to see them punished. Which law breakers get the attention of the cops is import though. Xman did NOT get a ticket for fishing by the freeway, as was stated earlier, he got a ticket for parking by the freeway. Please understand, I'm not happy about that. And I agree that it is a raw deal to allow people to park there for a long time and then all of a sudden, bam, here come the tickets. And it is even worse if they are putting up ladders over the fences in those places which only encourages that behavior. But, parking there has been illegal for a long time. And yes, it is OUR responsibility to know the laws. It isn't easy to keep up with it all but that's our responsibility as licensed motorists.

Consider this. What if Xman parked legally, but he was caught with 20 trout in his creel. How would you guys feel about that? We'd all want to hang him, wouldn't we? We'd all want him to get a healthy fine, right? And that's because it hurts our cause, fishing. Well... somethimes we have to pay our lumps. Xman ought to be glad he didin't get towed. So what does the illegal parking hurt anyway? Like I said earlier in the thread, it's the getting on and off the freeway that kills people. You can't safely merge into traffic that is going 65+ and that isn't expecting that kind of obstacle. One of MY causes is to get to and from my fishing holes without getting killed. So not parking along the freeway is important to me and I don't want to hear that any of you were killed that way either. I kindly ask that we all obey that law. If not for me, then for the sake of my kids who need a dad.

Maybe(and I mean maybe) the individual cop has less than pure motives but I believe the intent of the law is on target. If you don't like a law then work through the political process to get it changed to something better, but don't just go and do whatever you want. That is exactly why we keep losing more and more privileges to fish and hunt on certain lands. When a few people refuse to work within the established limits we all lose all of the privileges. Let's not bash the cops either. They do have a tough job. And they are not all jerks. I have been shown mercy by them a couple of times. How did I pulled it off? I showed respect to them and didn't argue. When they saw that I made an honest mistake they've cut me some slack.(and please don't accuse me of being a cop or pulling strings, it's not true)

To sum up. Lets' all obey the law graciously. If we don't we will lose more in the long run than we gain by breaking some law today. Look what happened at lake Powell and the jet skiers. Did they hose themselves up or what? Wouldn't we all agree that they deserve it? How many here have NOT been almost run over by one? Not many I bet. Luckily for them the loss of tourist dollars was more than the authorities could bare. If ATVers don't shape up and stay on the trails they will be banned from our public lands too. I don't own a ranch of my own to go to, do you? If hunters don't stop hunting in people's back yards, I along with you will continue to lose more and more hunting opportunities. The list possible losses goes on and on. Let's be people of honor for the sake of our sports.

Finally, the true judge of a man's character is what he does when nobody is looking. Let's all show some character and obey the law all the time and encourage other's to do the same. We all win that way and it is more fun.

Thanks, m
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