How do you tie on the tail hook?

[dustponds10]

I have seen some flies here in Idaho they are all streamers that have two hooks. ONe hook is the original fly then they tie on another hook with mono or wire. Does any one have a good tutorial for learning how to do this? I just cannot figure out how to secure the back hook to the front hook.
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[Dryrod]

[font "Garamond"][#008000][size 4]Hi there dustponds10 and welcome to the Fly Fishing forum. I haven't tied one of those doubles but I'm sure that our Flygoddess has tied a few. If she is not out there teasing the fish she should be stopping by shortly.[/size][/#008000][/font]
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[Scruffy_Fly]

If you look at the Charlie's flybox inc website and look up charlies wiggle damsel. The technique is explained clearly even though the pattern does not have a stinger hook.

People use line backing, wire, monofilament, or heavy tying thread which is looped through the eye of the back hook and the tied to the the shank of the fron hook.

So what you do is tie the back fly. Then wrap it onto the front hook and then finish tying the front hook fly.
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[macfly55]

when I first read this thread I was thinking I had seem a good explanation on how to do the second hook and now that you say Charlies flybox it all comes back to me ..

.. it is an excellent step by step instruction that a novice like me found easy to follow.. Id highly recommend checking it out..

MacFly [cool]
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[flygoddess]

I did a tutorial on another forum for the way I do it. It is old Steelhead style where I thread the STINGER (back hook) with a heavy mono. I then attach it to a needle, and thread it through Rabbit strips.
I then attach the mono to the front hook and add a dab of Zap-A-Gap (WATERPROOF superglue, as not all super glue is), but the fact it is threaded THROUGH the rabbit also ensures that it won't come off.
In this TUTORIAL, I had to use foam instead of Rabbit strips because you could see what I did.













Finished:



This is just one way and the threading is a little time consuming, which may or may not be worth it to all. I like it cause it keeps the two rabbit strips together and soft unlike gluing them.
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[dustponds10]

Hey all thank you for the warm welcome to the fly fishing forum. I am fishing trout and well steelhead on occasion so I will probably frequent this site often.

Thanks for the websites and for the tutorial that was posted. I appericate it a ton. Also on the rabbit strips what do you all reccomend? Buying the zonkered rabbit pelts or just buying the pelt that hasnt been cut? I have run into a problem of the zonkered not covering the hook shank and the weight that I tie onto the hook. What do you all prefer?
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[flygoddess]

There is CROSSED CUT strips that as labeled, is cross cut from the pelt. The fibers lay to one side, great for collars or wrapping the whole hook.
Zonker, the fibers lay back, more for tails. There is MAGNUM ZONKER STRIPS that are wider strips. Awesome for bigger flies.
You can cut your own from a pelt, but I have a hard time doing it as I end up cutting the hair also, so, I opt for the easy way.
Orvis carries a fantastic line of Zonker and Magnum Zonker, as does Hareline.
I do notice the packages at like SPORTSMAN's getting smaller, which is a bummer, so I have my favorite supply. Jimmy's in Idaho Falls, Portneuf River Fly (Roger) in Pocatello, Fish Tech in Salt Lake and The Fly Desk (Dennis) in Salt Lake. All these shops will ship also.
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[dustponds10]

What I am tying are mostly streamers with the rabbit hide and they are mostly larger flies like sizes 2-6. I guess for the collar(which I think is refering to right behind the eye of the hook) I should get the Magnum zonkers and or the Cross cut and just use the regular zonkers for the tails.

On your streamers do you usually just tie them like the tutorial that is posted? I only see really two pieces of zonker material. Is the tail and the boddy of the streamer one solid piece of material? Sorry if I am repeating what you have said I just want to make sure that I can get this right. It really bugs me to see the hook shaft even though my flies are catching fish. I want them to be pretty to my eye as well.
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[flygoddess]

The top and the bottom form the tail. In other words yes there are only two long strips.
For the collar, crossed cut would definitely be cool. I just use feathers like Marabou, Guinea, Mallard, but rabbit would give a nice thick head. Maybe even more like a minnow.
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[dustponds10]

Ok so I am following pretty well. I am very new at this and there for I have a lot of questions. Sorry, I was following along right up until you said you attach the mono to the front hook. How do you do this so that it wont come off? Do you just wrap around it and glue it or do you tie the mono around the shank or something? i cannot figure that part out very well. Thanks Dustin
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[Dryrod]

[center][font "Garamond"][#008000][size 4]Hi dustponds10 - I just sent you a PM re this subject.[/size][/#008000][/font]
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[flygoddess]

Very good questions! I lay the mono that is connected to the stinger on the front hook shank and lash it down with the thread I will be using on the rest of the fly. ALSO< as you can see, I put the front hook THROUGH the bottom strip before I secure the stinger. This also helps to keep the two strips together as I don't tie the bunny strip to the front hook except just behind the eye.

Great questions....keep them coming[cool]
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[macfly55]

hey sis.. since I cant seem to remember things today.. when you secure the mono to the front hook.. I am guessing you start at the bend in the hook and go forward to the eye ... now do you tie in the chenille before you go forward to the eye.. or do you come back to the bend... tie in the chenille.. and then forward to the eye again????

MacFly [cool]
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[flygoddess]

come back and tie it in. I wrap the mono down pretty good so it is secure.
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[macfly55]

thats what I thought but wanted to clarify.. silly on the side question.. would it do any good to use a bit of head cemment to really set the mono or is that overkill.. ??

MacFly [cool]
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[flygoddess]

Not at all, I use Zap-A-Gap.
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[macfly55]

cool.. I got it right two times in a row.. LOL...

MacFly [cool]
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[Scruffy_Fly]

I have read where some steel headers lay the stinger over the eye of the hook. Tie the mono or backing line to the shank with touching wraps of thread from the bend to the eye. then Pull the stinger back towards the rear of the tying vice. Then using touching wraps tie the additional length of mono or backing line from hook eye to the bend. Thus you have two layers of the mono secured to the hook shank with two layers of thread. As Fly Goddess says the Zapagap is a good thing to add in there.

If you are using the bunny strips with the mono through the bunny strips then you would need to alter the procedure a little to accomplish the same thing.

I think the above is probably over kill but it would add an other level of confidence that the mono is not going to pull off the hook shank.
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[macfly55]

when you say the above is overkill.. are you referring to what FG has shown.. or the double wrap tying that you initally described.. just trying to get it clear in my head.. :-)

MacFly [cool]
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[Scruffy_Fly]

What I said.

If you are fishing for trout under 20" the ZapAgap is probably over kill also. But it is so easy to do. Other than trying to keep good ZapAGap on hand. The tube generally is hard by the time I get around to using it a second time.
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