CRAPPIE

[MikeHall]

Save Yellow Perch Lives ..
Catch more Crappie ..
Watch "Hooked On Utah "
Saturday Ch.2 CBS SLC
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[perchound]

Sorry Mike, I gotta disagree cause there aren't enough crappie lakes around here, and plenty of perch lakes. Please leave some crappie to grow for all us crappie lovers.

I would think as many people that have been hammering the crappie at PV they should be thinned out enough by now.
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[Fishsticker]

Nice photos!
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[MikeHall]

Politics make for poor fishing .. Managing for quality rather then production makes legends of fisheries & satisfies the soul of a fisherman .. Don't care for politics but will listen to science should you have any to show ..
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[perchound]

Just what I thought you'd say.
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[BEARCLAW]

Way to go Mike. Keep doing your thing :-)
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[PACKFAN]

Me too[]
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[PACKFAN]

How many trips have you made to Cascade perch fishing so far this year.....don't preach to me.
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[utahgolf]

I fully agree. The crappie explosion at pv is unreal. Just go fish there in the spring and see how many there are on every single bush. and you won't see any perch at all. They need to remove the limits on crappie. and even then there won't be much of dent made. The size has remained the same for the past few years, they just can't grow with that many in there. Some people like catching dinks though and will complain and be fearful of the crappie being "fished" out. Just like those who complain about fish lake and the perch being fished out.
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[Jedidiah]

Fished PV a lot this year, on ice and off. The roving bands of rapacious crappie are unreal, and tasty, but I was really hoping for PV perch. I'll make due with a few pounds of meat from Fish Lake and Starvation perch, I guess.
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[perchound]

I respect all of your opinions and trust me, I love catching perch as much as anyone. But the crappie explosion at PV is a great thing and there are plenty of other places to catch perch. It was about 5 or 6 years ago that the crappie were amazing and they just got wiped out from being over fished. Now their back and I agree they needed some thinning but it sure would be nice if they could stay. Their are so many people that go nuts over filling their freezers rather it be from PV or Willard and I don't understand why. The same situation at Willard last year, I spoke to fishermen that we're going out and getting their limits of crappie every day for as long as the bite was on and you can't tell me that someone can eat that many fish that fast, it's just greed and this is why our crappie populations never sustain for very long.

I watched the outdoor show on channel 2 and it was great to see all them guys having fun catching crappie. The only problem I have with this is now there's going to be twice as many people up there fishing for the crappie. It's just like when Doug Miller had his show on the perch fishing at Rockport and the perch fest up there. Where did all the perch go everyone thought, hello.

My point is, we need not be greedy if we truly enjoy fishing!

Just my opinion and you don't have to agree with it. I don't claim to be a scientist or fishiers biologist but I have fished Utah for over 50 years and have a good understanding of what's happening with our fisheries.

NEED TO LEAVE SOME FOR SEED >))))'>
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]Drought cycles and lack of food resources have much greater effects on fish population and growth rates than anglers ever have.

The big crappies of several years ago were the remnants of a former big year class. They were plentiful and small for several years...just like the current supply. As they got thinned out and had more of the available food supply to eat they grew big. Then one year they had their last spawn and died.

Pineview does not have a natural food base...like chubs or other minnows. The predators rely solely on baby perch or baby crappies for their food. When the perch get off a good spawn, and there are an abundance of baby perch, there are both more perch and more crappies that grow to good sizes.

About 5 years ago there was a good high water spring and the crappies spawned heavily...much better than the perch did earlier when water levels were lower...with little flooded brush and vegetation. The newly hatched perch and crappies both provided nutrition for bigger perch and crappies...and there were some good sized fish caught of both species...through the next winter. But after that the balance tipped. The larger predators slurped up more of the baby perch than the baby crappies and the crappie population became dominant. Perch that survived to at least 5 or 6 inches were too big for larger perch and crappies...but they didn't have much to eat...so they stunted. And each year class of crappies preyed heavily on each new crop of perch and crappies...which became fewer and fewer in the low spring waters during our drought.

Both the few surviving perch and the bumper crop of crappies in Pineview today continue to mostly wipe out the meager new hatchling crop each year. Then they survive by slurping up invertebrates for most of their nutrition. They can eke out a living on the bitty bites but they do not grow as fast as when they have more finny protein.

If we have a good runoff and the lake fills by the time crappies spawn in April and May, there will be much more food for the remaining larger crappies. And we can probably count on catching some over 12 inches by the end of the year. But the larger fish will not live much longer. Far more of them will die of old age than will be harvested by anglers.
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[ChalkCreekUT]

Interesting concept.

The DWR held an ice fishing seminar in January 2015. Had Chris Penne, one of their Aquatics Biologists, talk about Pineview. I'll put a link to the full seminar can be seen below. The Pineview portion starts around 1:24:30 mark.

Since I'm not a biologist I can't disagree with his assessment. "Perch are a species that don't do well when you have really high fluctuations in water levels."

If that's true I'm not sure how catching more crappie will benefit the perch. While it will provide more food it appears the water level cycling is to blame. Good luck getting everyone in Ogden to stop watering the lawn.


Looks like video didn't embed. Here's the address
http://youtu.be/cxHlcS4hM-0?t=6m50s
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[perchound]

Thanks for the info TD, do you know what the max average age is for the crappie before they die?
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]I wasn't 100% sure myself. I had heard about 5 years. Checked several online sources. Seems that most are caught or die before 5 years of age but rare ones in protected environments may live a couple of years longer.

After making my previous post I had a remembery flash. In the years of previous better fishing for larger crappies and perch in Pineview I remember looking first for schools of baby perch down near the bottom and then fishing those areas for the predators. And almost all the fish I caught were barfing perchlets. I have seen the same thing a couple of years ago...with baby crappies. But baby perch seem to be the preferred forage for both species when they are available.

In the past two or three years I have not been able to locate any schools of baby perch or crappies in the usual fall spots. And none of the fish I have caught have shown evidence or stomach contents of feeding on baby perch.

Most of the super crappie and perch lakes in other parts of the country have at least two or more species of abundant forage minnows. Tough duty for Utah fish that have to provide their own food...and eat their own young to survive.

We gotta be properly grateful during the years of plenty and wait patiently during the down times. Trouble is that the older we get the fewer cycles we are going to live through our own selves.
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[perchpile2]

In fishing Echo, we are catching various sizes of perch. I'm pretty sure that indicates multiple years of successful spawn. The perch aren't thick, but I think we could very well see a few good to great years for Echo in the near future.
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]Yeah. Echo had a near miss. Almost drained too low for perch to survive. But enough did survive and spawn each year for the past few years that there are multiple year classes and hope for it returning to one of the better perch ponds.

From the reports this year the bigger fish are dining on the smaller ones...but there are enough to go around. Hopefully enough will survive to become bigger ones and make a lot of babies.
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[MikeHall]

This may help with the confusion about harvesting of Crappie - Yellow Perch or Walleye .. You will note that these waters are not polluted like Utah and provide ideal habitats for Temperate species... Our water is treated only for Solids , passing on the phosphate and Nitrates.. The nitrates feed blue green allege witch removes all the oxygen in the summer months.. This kills both plant and fish life and adds to methyl mercury levels in the system... The fish stocks of these species require several years (5 to 8) to reach growth lengths of 13 to 18 inches..
Want more and bigger Crappie - Yellow Perch - Walleye improve habitat ( rock structures ), address the water pollution , reduce limits and spawn harvest... Oh yes most important end catch and release the mortality is to high on the released fish.. Finally leave them in the lake they take much longer to grow the the wild trout we hold so highly..
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[dubob]

[quote TubeDude][#0000ff]Drought cycles and lack of food resources have much greater effects on fish population and growth rates than anglers ever have.[/#0000ff][/quote][font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]What Pat said! And if you bother to research by fish species, you will find little, if any, evidence that perch or crappie are considered managed fish species in Utah. For the reason already stated by Pat, and the fact that Utah water environments have extreme fluctuations in water levels from year to year, perch and crappie populations have been, are, and will continue to be a boom or bust situation in Utah. [/#800000][/font]
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]Yessir, yessir.

Walleyes are perhaps the best example of "non-managed" species. Right up there with smallmouth and largemouth bass. DWR may have made the original plantings but after that the fish are pretty much on their own. Yes...regulations to help reflect current populations and angler pressure. No to any supplemental plantings, habitat improvement or food resource enhancement...like planting chubs, shiners, fathead minnows, crawfish or other food species. That's how most other states maintain good fisheries.

Howsomever, in spite of all the slings and arrows of outrageous boom and bust cycles, Utah still provides some pretty good fishing. Only thing is that us "younger" anglers just no longer have the time to wait out some of the cycles until good fishing returns. Think Yuba. Whimper, whimper.
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