Question on whirling disease

[Red-head]

I've been watching a post on kamloomps going into Flaming Gorge. DrewT comments brought up two questions that I have always had ebbing at the back of my mind. Never thought to ask on this board (duh!)[blush].

First question, why does DWR plant sterile fish. If you say its because they don't want cross breeding, I can comprehend that. BUT if it is because of whirling disease please enlighten me. I don't understand this disease much and I'm willing to bet there are many on this board who don't either.

Ok so my first question is really 2 questions (teach me about WD and teach me why plant sterilized fish). My next question is that of places like Willard, Porcupine, and Causey. DrewT mentioned that these are oligotropic (yes Drew I had to get out my dictionary). For those of you like me who don't comprehend such big words [sly] it means that there is little vegetation. This is why, as Drew mentions, some of these waters don't support growth very well. Why doesn't DWR try planting aquatic plants so that these waters aren't so sterile? It seems to be it would a good thing.

Thats enough for now! If you got the answer/opinion, I'm all ears!
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[gshorthair]

Let me try to help you understand why these things are being done. First alot of this is experimental. Whirling disease attacks the young fish of certain species. Other species seem to be fairly resistant. The hybrids are used because they seem to be more resistant. Another reason is if whirling disease does not find a good host maybe the life cycle can be broken. This would decrease the chance of infecting young fish in the future.
The question of aquatic plants is fairly simple. This state has alot of resevoirs that have tremendous fluctuations in water levels. You mentioned willard. Look at the how low the water level has been the last few years. If the DWR spent alot of money trying to plant the perimeter of the lake and the water drops too low all the plants die and we have wasted alot of money. Normally if the conditions are right mother nature will provide the plants. Here is a good example. When the great salt lake flooded the marshes around it in the 1980's the once productive marsh vegetation was destroyed leaving only salty mud flats. Within a few years the marshes returned as the salt that killed the plants was washed away. The marshes weren't planted by the DWR. They just made sure there was plenty of water and the plants returned on their own. The same goes with Yellowstone. There are millions of trees growing in areas that burned. The park service hasn't planted any of those trees. The proper environmental will grow plenty of plants. If the right conditions aren't there the the plants won't survive even if you plant them. I hope this helps. gshorthair
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[kokeking]

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I don't think there is really a link between sterilized fish and whirling disease.


i have to agree tube dude, it been my understanding the what causes whirling diease is a form of parasite.It attaches its self to the very small fish and attacks the body and infects the fish.Doesnt seem to matter sterile or not.

Red Head iam not sure about your comment about planting sterile fish ,i was under the impression that the kamaloop strain that will be used in the gorge are not sterile,i may be wrong and correct me if iam.but i always though that they were breeders.
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[DrewT]

These guys have given you solid answers. Hybrids, as tubedude said, are used to control populations and add diversity to a given area. If a population of hybrids gets out of control, you quit stocking. If a hybrid leaves a system (gets over the dam and down the river), it will eventually just die of and not repopulate. The reason that they use splake and tiger trout so often is because unlike the Onchorynchus genus (rainbow and cutthroat), the Salvelinus genus and the Salmo genus are more tolerant of the disease.

As far as trying to make a body more eutrophic, tubedude again hit it on the head. In general, just throwing in vegetation will not ensure more food. It is a whole ecosystem thing that includes available nutrients, sunlight, water temperature and clarity, biodiversity, and on and on.

Hope this helps.
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[Red-head]

TD, I can be more full if it that you think![laugh] No kkk, I was not refering to kamloops being sterilized before going into FG, but rather more general. TD, I agree with you. I don't think its a sanitation issue either. But again if it is because of population control... some places don't make sense. Strawberry for example. Why there? Didn't you say that years ago the big 'bows at FG were always full of suckers? Seems to me that DWR want to regulate more than just the population. Yeah, it sounds like I may be answering my own question. But not really. There are lots of DWR practices I don't understand. And not to dis on them but I feel like they are running in circles sometimes. I understand the hybrid issue. They don't naturally reproduce. Makes for good put and take. Its also great to have another species to go after. But the 'bows will reproduce naturally, and given the opportunity they become good preditors right? Thats the only way to get big.

Again TD your carp answer makes the most sense. Especially for Willard. Carp aside, that still doesn't satisfy me completely. There are some things in life I guess your never going to be comletely satisfied with eh? For example, you'd think there would be some kind of plants that would take quick advantage of receeding waterlines.
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[wormandbobber]

Sterile rainbows are stocked in Strawberry to avoid potential cross-breeding with the Bear Lake cutts...the DWR is trying to establish a self-sustaining population of Bear Lake cutts because they evolved as piscivorous fish.They also wish to maintain the genetic integrity of the species. Rainbow trout, although they also will eat other fish, are not as piscivorous as the Bear Lake cutts.
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[RipNLips]

Here's how planting sterile trout could theoretically put a dent in WD in a given body of water.

WD only infects fingerling trout so only plant trout large enough to not be susceptible to WD. On top of that, only plant sterile trout so the ones you plant can't make fingerlings themselves. No fingerlings, no infected trout, WD life cycle broken.

Here's why that method will never completely get rid of WD.

How many trout fisheries can you think of that have NO fertile trout in them. On top of that, the dormant WD spores can last for up to 30 years so you'd have to keep fertile trout out of the fishery for that long.

Seems to me like the only way to get rid of WD is to eradicate one of it's hosts and thereby break it's life cycle. We certainly don't want to eradicate trout (some bass fisherman may think otherwise), so that leaves the Tubifex worms. I think we're stuck with WD to one degree or another until someone comes up with something (biological or chemical) that can be dumped in a body of water and selectively kill Tubifex worms without any other environmental effect.
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