some minnows for bait questions?

[Jedburton]

Hey I just got through catching a whole bunch of minnows from strawberry reservior to use for baite and I am curious what kinds of fish they will work the best for. Do they work well for catfish, walleye, whitebass, big mouths, smalleys, etc. I am just curious what they work the best for. Do they work as well as carp minnows at utah lake? If not where and when can I catch some carp minnows to freeze and use later this winter for fishing,

Jed Burton

p.s. I also caught a couple of real big ones around 9" or so and cut them up into 1 and a half inch pieces for cut baite. Any pointers on how to use them the best?
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[TubeDude]

[cool]Congrats on making a good haul of minnows. If you haven't already done so, I suggest you freeze them in packages of about a dozen. If you have a vacuum sealer, that is the best. However, if you do not, then use stout plastic (not ziplock).

First, carefully arrange the minnows so that they are straight and not bent. Add just a small amount (teaspoon or so) of water and squeeze out all of the air bubbles before twisting and rubber banding the bag. This prevents freezer burn and the minnows are "fresher" when you thaw them.

The fish species you listed all eat small minnows, and they don't check for ID...where they came from. As long as they are dead, they are legal to use almost anywhere. One of the most effective ways to fish them is to hook them up through the head, with a size six or eight hook...depending on the size of the bait and the type fish you are going after. Do not use weight unless you have to cast farther than you can pitch the minnow without weight. Then use the lightest weight you can...or a small bubble with just enough water to allow a slow, natural sink. That is what you want...to make the fish think they are being served a minnow that has just croaked.

This works especially well in clearer waters, where trout, bass, walleye and other predators can see the sinking minnow from a distance. But, it is also effective on finicky cats, or other fish in murkier water, that would reject a bait if they felt too much resistance...like from a sinker. You can add to the finesse approach by leaving the bail open on your reel and allowing the fish to take some line before setting the hook. On some days, that will not be necessary, because the fish will gulp and go. But, on other days, they pick it up and drop it a couple of times before getting it down far enough for a good hookset.

Almost any fish flesh works for cats in Utah Lake, and your minnows should be welcomed there by everything. Whether they will work better than carp minnows, I do not know, but I would guess it should be about equal. Maybe you can take a poll (pole). I used to catch and preserve a lot of carp minnows every year and they worked gangbusters for everything in the lake, all year.

I think the time for finding the large schools of small carp minnows is well past for this year. If my memory is working correctly (not always reliable), I would say that I had my best harvests in the lower Provo and in the stickups south of the Provo River inlet from about mid June through early July. Then they scatter out into the open lake and take their chances. But, while they are bunched up in schools you can seine, scoop or cast them by the thousands. Hint, you can sometimes get a bunch by dropping a minnow trap around the docks in the harbors, baited with a piece of bread.

The larger minnows you got (I'm guessing chubs) can be fished several ways. If you want BIG cats, fish them whole. You won't get as many bites, but the ones you get will be worthwhile. A nine inch chub is only a light snack for a twenty pound channel cat. I have found whole white bass, crappies, sunfish and even carp up to over a pound in their guts. To fish the chunks, use a larger size hook...maybe size 1 to 2/0...beak style or "octopus" style...and just wrap the hook around the spine in the middle. Better yet, try the new circle hooks...but do not strike to set the hook. Let the fish set the hook by pulling it into the corner of their mouth. That has been the subject of other threads in the past.

If I have large chubs or small suckers, I prefer to scale them, fillet them and then use the scaled (skin on) fillets either whole or cut into smaller strips. These work well by themselves or as additions to jigs, as sweetener.

I will suggest that you save some of your minnows for fishing the lower Provo in the fall. As soon as the temps start falling and the fish get more active, there are a lot of fish that leave Utah Lake and wander up the lower part of the river, resting in the deeper holes. Fishing those minnows on a weightless line is a good way to catch some big white bass, lots of cats and a few walleyes too. Early and late in the day is always best...and, of course, at night...especially during the full moon of September and October. If you do not get a pickup on the drop...or shortly thereafter...drag the head hooked minnow along the bottom periodically...or give it a little "shivver lift" once in awhile to make it look like a distressed baitfish.

Well, that's my input. Any minner exspurts out there got any other helpful idears for JB here?
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[Kent]

TD suggests a size 6 to 8 size hook; however, every time I have used a hook that small I have been extremely successful at fattening fish but not successful at catching them. I have had my best luck by far by using a size 2 to 4 thin sharp hook. I also responded to many of the questions posed above on the casting net thread.
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[TubeDude]

[cool]Obviously, hook size and type are a matter of personal preference, gained through experience and experimentation. Some of the factors to consider are size of minnow, size of fish, method of hooking minnow, etc. There is also the issue of the type of hook being used. Some manufacturers hook sizes are larger or smaller than those of other manufacturers rated at the same size.

I agree with Kent, in that having a bigger hook bite will result in more hookups, in most cases. But, when using smaller minnows and/or the fish are acting hookshy, then you may want to downsize as a means of getting more bites. Just keep experimenting until you get exactly the right combo. The fish will let you know when you've got it right.

One interesting situation that happens to the live bait fishermen on the Pacific coast is fishing for some of the tuna species. Sometimes the available bait (anchovies) are very small (pinheads), and it takes a small hook to present them properly. Even average sized anchovies, from five to seven inches long are sometimes rejected by the sharp-visioned tunas in the ultra clear offshore waters. It seems strange to fish with size 6 hooks, on 12 pound line, for hefty tuna that may weigh over 50 pounds. You don't always get the hook in them, and many are lost to popped lines or spooled reels, but the only other option is just washing bait all day with a straight stick.
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[Kent]

I have a friend in California who swears that he catches large fish in the ocean fishing with live gold fish (the 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 inch feeder size). I tried them (dead) once at Strawberry and I thought they were too small for trout.
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[TubeDude]

[cool]I don't know about using them in the ocean. I suspect that the salt water would not keep them alive long. However, I know that they are popular as a bait for catfish. In fact, along the lower Colarado River, a LARGE goldfish is the favored bait for LARGE flathead catfish. You can sell all the ten inch goldfish you could get, at a premium price, to the dedicated flathead fishermen along the Colorado.

There are many areas around the country where both using live bait and goldfish are legal. Consequently, a lot of lakes have hefty populations of big goldfish. In Lake Cachuma, near Santa Barbara in California, they massed up for spawning, like all carpkind, in the soring. Whole bays would be a bright orange as the two pound plus goldies did their spring fling. Within a couple of months after spawning, the best color lures to troll for big rainbows in the lake would be the bright orange Rapalas. And both largemouth and smallmouth hit them around the rocky shorelines.

In a situation where the trout have patterned on the shiners and chubs, I suspect that goldfish might seem to be an alien food source to them. If they were hungry, and at least took a test munch on a goldfish, I'm sure you could catch trout on them in Strawberry. But, when you have become so proficient at gathering FREE minnows with your cast net, why would you want to spend the money to buy goldfish, only to kill them for bait?
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[Kent]

[size 1]"But, when you have become so proficient at gathering FREE minnows with your cast net, why would you want to spend the money to buy goldfish, only to kill them for bait?"[/size]

[size 1]No matter how many fish I am catching I am still always looking for the secret bait/lure that will catch even more and bigger fish. Am I the only one who does this, or will other fishermen/women admit to this same weakness of character?[/size]
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[TubeDude]

[cool]Not me. I had to turn in my membership to ''Rationalizers Anonymous".
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[aquaman]

if looking for a better bait/lure to catch more or bigger fish is a weakness of character then i'm ashamed because i am a weak weak man

chris
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[Jedburton]

thanks for all the good advice. I will print it out and add it to my "fishing manual"[].

jb
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[Jedburton]

should I spice it up with anything?
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