Walleye in Echo

[Troll]

The bucket bio's have been at it again. This time stocking Walleye into Echo Res. DWR says a couple dozen were caught in their gill nets. That leads me to believe that there are many more than that.

Break out the crawler harnesses...

http://www.ksl.com/?sid=41502918&nid=128...-reservoir
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[albinotrout]

I read the KSL article. This may be good for short term but the long term effects are very damaging.
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[RockyRaab]

I can't get my head around the fact that bucket commandos can plant at most a few hundred fish into a lake and they take the place over - but the DNR plants tens of thousands of new fish that simply disappear.

Bafflement.
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[fsh4fun05]

That's funny. I thought the same thing when I read the article this morning. Better to make the public aware now and see if they can get them out of there. If there are enough to spawn in the springtime it might be a different story
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[Troll]

You make an excellent point Rocky.

Course, we're not fisheries biologists, so there is that...

It would seem that maybe the biologists need some lessons on how to stock fish from the bucketeers.

I agree Albino, not good for the long haul, but not much is good for the long haul in most Utah waters. The natural lakes, yes, but most reservoirs are drawn down so much each year that there is little habitat for young to hide in and few bugs for them to feed on.

Sooo, this is where we are now, I for one am going to get me some bottom bouncers, some worm harnesses and some crawlers and see if I can cash in on some walleye while the getting is good. I bet they will taste way better than Utah lake or Willard walleye and without the vastness of little to no structure they should be easier to find consistently. This is an excellent time of year for kayaks, tubes/toons and small boats on Echo.
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[doggonefishin]

[quote RockyRaab]I can't get my head around the fact that bucket commandos can plant at most a few hundred fish into a lake and they take the place over - but the DNR plants tens of thousands of new fish that simply disappear.

Bafflement.[/quote]


Maybe it gives one some idea how pervasive the problem is and how numerous the bucketeers are. Read the comments on the KSL article. There's more than a few respondents that seem pretty excited about the news.
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[wiperhunter2]

Makes you wonder if they put them in Rockport too[:/].
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[albinotrout]

[quote wiperhunter2]Makes you wonder if they put them in Rockport too[:/].[/quote]

Or lost creek[:/]
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[Troll]

Excited about the news and having anything to do with it happening are two different worlds.

I'm pleased to be able to fish for them there. I also would never transplant fish from one body of water to another. My educational background in fish and wildlife management taught me the possible effects that could have on a body of water.

Fact is that walleye are in Echo, catchable, mature walleye. I doubt anything but poison or total drawdown removing every drop of water will get them out. They will eat themselves out of forage, over populate, stunt and enter the boom/bust cycle that many Utah reservoirs do. May as well make the best of it while we can.

On a side note it would seem from the comments that many fishers are tired of SNIT's (Stocked Nine Inch Trout) and that the division needs to adjust their management objectives to satisfy it's customers.

The department is well aware of what the people want, they have the species available for stocking, yet they refuse to implement the program preferring to close hatcheries infected with whirling disease rather than switch production to other species not affected. Even in this article they mention stocking sterile walleye to trick the non-steriles into thinking they are reproducing when they will not be. Why not just plant the sterile walleye instead of the trout if that is what the customers want.
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[cje04]

From surveys, etc. what percent of people want Walleyes? Of the 5 lakes within a couple hours of SLC that have Walleyes how heavily are they utilized for the Walleyes?
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[harlin]

I've fished DC in the fall many times when the walleyes are biting and see very few other anglers out there targeting them..The hordes of yearning phantom walleye anglers have yet to show themselves. After all, it only takes one person to move fish with a bucket. If somebody can't catch a walleye out of Deer Creek, they won't catch one out of Echo..
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[Troll]

1. Utah lake is a cesspool that this year was closed to all recreation due to algae blooms. The state themselves ordered that no fish be taken or eaten from the lake.

2. Willard Bay is managed for mainly Wipers, not Walleye and is not great walleye habitat, walleye are stocked, at the size of 1/4". If you have been paying attention the walleye are being heavily fished for, in the spring near the south marina.

3. Yuba, was a premier lake for walleye, fished heavily for them, till the cycle went bust. NOw better for pike, which seem to be also slacking off. This is due to drawdown and loss of critical habitat as a result. Artificial reefs placed in the water do not seem to be producing the results hoped for.

4. Starvation is heavily utilised for walleye fishing, and has been for the 30 years I have known about it. Look at a underwater map and you will see why. lots of rock, humps, coves, STRUCTURE.

5. Deer Creek, again a marginal walleye lake due to massive drawdown creating a lack of habitat for young walleye and the forage they depend on.

Having walleys and being a walleye fishery are two different things. Starvation is a walleye fishery.
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[Troll]

Fall is a bad comparison, fall has hunting seasons to compete against. A better question would be how many are targeting them in the spring? When anglers line up on the Charleston bridge for a chance at them.

I ask, how many fishers do you see at all when you are out there targeting them?

Walleye are not the easiest fish to catch, they require patience, persistence and the proper presentation. (Kims words for Tiger Musky) Once you understand them they are much easier to catch.


Walleye are in echo, whine and moan all you want about it, it won't change.

Now, if walleye are not wanted, then why has the department put them in Red Fleet, Sandwash and other bodies they were not in previously?

Because they are what the people prefer over SNIT's.
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[SBennett]

I think more people will fish DC in the fall when the mussel alert is lifted there next year.
Yesterday the wait to decon was 2 hrs.
A surf boat that still had 10 day old Powell water in the ballast tanks was behind myself (outboard) and a Tracker with a 115 outboard.
I'm just glad I got in line before the surf boat!!!
I am still hoping the State will figure out a way to give the outboard guys a quicker and/or simpler decon method?
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[Fowl-Hook]

I would like to see Walleye in Rockport, Echo and Jordanelle, none drain to the Colorado drainage so the Feds would be out of the picture. . All three are marginal Trout waters that abound with water sports entheuiasts and Smallmouth that could use a Predator. All three are subject to stressful water levels due to consumption and sketchy precipitation in the future. Try something different than TROUT for a change.
I'm Not a Fan of Sterile Management plans that provide leverage for additional funding and resources every year, simply because no resources have been directed to any natural producing species.
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[doggonefishin]

Obviously, you are excited about this news and will be fishing for them. Have at it. Nobody, including the DWR, is going to mind.

A couple of additional comments.

1. [quote Troll]
On a side note it would seem from the comments that many fishers are tired of SNIT's (Stocked Nine Inch Trout) and that the division needs to adjust their management objectives to satisfy it's customers.

The department is well aware of what the people want, they have the species available for stocking, yet they refuse to implement the program preferring to close hatcheries infected with whirling disease rather than switch production to other species not affected. Even in this article they mention stocking sterile walleye to trick the non-steriles into thinking they are reproducing when they will not be. Why not just plant the sterile walleye instead of the trout if that is what the customers want.[/quote]


Here is where I strongly disagree. It seems to me that the DWR is bending over backwards right now to appease every single group of anglers that is whining to them. How else do you explain that places like Red Fleet and Jordanelle are having virtually every warmwater species under the sun stocked in them? What doesn't Red Fleet have in it right now? Jordanelle is not terribly different with wipers and tiger muskies, plus what was already there. The tired argument that the DWR only uses stocker rainbows in our midlevel lakes ignores reality. Even with this effort, they STILL get bashed by some for these decisions, right?

2. I disagree that the bucket biologists and vocal whiners on surveys and message boards represent a true majority of anglers desiring these warmwater species. The majority still just want to go catch a few fish when they go out using simple methods. Trout are still desired by them, as well as more serious anglers. Even so, the warmwater potential in our mid level lakes is endless. Name one midlevel lake/reservoir that does not have warmwater fishing opportunities.

3. Some warmwater groups, like the muskie anglers, go through the proper channels (and a lot of work) to have their preferred species added to a fishery, but some jerks take it upon themselves to do it themselves. Very selfish and disappointing.

4. EVERY one of these threads whining for more walleyes (or other warmwater species) bitches about trout management and how they are sick of trout. However, planting walleyes in Echo will only mildly change trout management there. They will just have to plant a slightly larger trout there. However, trout and walleyes coexist just fine. Anyone heard of Starvation steelhead? Deer creek has been a good rainbow trout fishery for years, even with the inevitable ups and downs of its warmwater fishery. What species will suffer from this introduction?
Perch and maybe smallmouth bass. So the bucket bio action doesn't hurt trout anglers, but does hurt fellow warmwater anglers. Nice.

5. Using sterile species allows the DWR to have some level of control over the system and smooth out the boom and bust cycle, which is otherwise inevitable in most natural systems. It also allows for a do over if there are unintended bad results from an introduction. Fishermen hate the bust part of the cycle and inevitably complain to the DWR about it. It also seems from this thread that they get complaints when they do give people what they want. You can't seem to win working for the DWR. [:/]
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[Troll]

I wouldn't say I am excited. Excited is when I am watching a massive school of boiling wipers headed right at me or watching a Tiger Musky chase my lure while I figure 8 it at the side of the boat. That excites me.

Yes, I will be fishing for them, I like Echo, it gets less pressure, it's easy to get to, it has opportunities surrounding it that are good for other things I like to fish for and now it appears to have a viable, for the near future anyway, population of my favorite fish to eat. I will probably be there this evening in my kayak, with very little company...

I am pleased that no one will mind when I kill the walleye I catch, I am pleased that I can contribute to the management of this species in this body of water for the DWR. I'm a pretty good walleye fisher when they are in typical walleye water and not some vast featureless shallow pond.

Did I want Walleye in there? NOt that I can consciously remember, but that point is mute.

It was mentioned above that someone wants them in Rockport and Jordanelle and although I think they would do OK in Jordanelle, I don't desire that, like was mentioned, plenty of things being put in there already, let's see how that works out before adding anything else.
Rockport? I hope not, it's just a small pass through body of water that is already managed well for nice sized trout. Nice sized being the main point there.

Red Fleet is like Starvation, numerous coves, points, shallow rock piles, deep rock piles, STRUCTURE, walleye love structure. I explain it by stating that those waters are well suited for the species now being stocked, better than they are for trout. Utah is a desert, a warm desert with many waters better suited for warm water fishes, that's just the way it is, geographically.
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[Kent]

[quote Dog-lover]

I would like to see Walleye in Rockport, Echo and Jordanelle, none drain to the Colorado drainage so the Feds would be out of the picture. . All three are marginal Trout waters...

[/quote]

Not sure what your definition of a "marginal" is, but they all produce some nice trout.
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[Therapist]

The introduction of walleye into Echo is a slap in the face to all legal sportsman. Just because some idiot decides that they know better how to manage our waters than the DWR, they make if difficult for the DWR to manage things. I would bet that Rockport also got stocked which would be another black eye for us.

One reason that the bucket intros seem to do better than DWR stockings is that the bucket intros are usually mature adult fish, while the DWR stocks fry/fingerlings. The mature adults will swim around for several years, spawning and getting several year classes in the system while the DWR has to raise and plant. Remember, DWR will be planting only several thousand to several hundred thousand fry into a lake while one mature female will equal or exceed that. You have a few dozen mature females and they will produce several million fry a year, so the introduction of mature fish will exceed the planting of the DWR, hence the appearance that the illegal intros are more successful, in some cases they are.

[T-DOG91]

But can anyone tell me if my precious Browns upstream will be ok? Or are the walleye going to eat all the fish in the closest blue ribbon fishery to my house?
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